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Post by itrainmonkeys on Apr 20, 2010 8:50:19 GMT -5
below are two posts about the Nateva/Live Nation discussion. From a new thread that will be closed soon: First of all, I would like to thank Frank for his, well...frankness with regard to his association with Live Nation. That being said, I believe we have a potentially serious problem with this "partnership". Frank has assured us that the relationship with Live Nation is strictly a booking arrangement, and I have absolutely no problem with that. In fact, I think it is essentially a waste of time to boycott this organization, because the 600 pound gorilla is already in the room. Good luck getting the corrupt ba#$%^ds in Congress to do anything about this monopolistic situation. The problem is clearly in the details. The plan, as presented by Nateva LLC., is for Nateva to be an ongoing major outdoor camping festival for many years to come. That is great, and I am all for it. Actually thrilled about it. However, we have been presented with details, which are fully documented, of a plan by Live Nation to build a 20,000 seat amphitheater in Oxford, on the site of the fairgrounds. The same location as the Festival. As someone who has lived in Maine most of my life, and someone who has been to Oxford for races many times, that fairground area cannot possibly support a 15,000 person festival, with camping, AND a 20,000 seat amphitheater with mandated parking, facilities, etc. So, unfortunately, as someone who has been involved in politics for most of my life, on both sides, I have come to the inescapable conclusion that there is a "rat in the kitchen"(Bonus points for anyone who catches that musical reference.) One, or both of the parties involved in these projects is full of you know what. Either Nateva LLC. is using Live Nation to BS the town of Oxford into accepting the festival concept, with promises to build the amphitheater, or Live Nation is using Frank and Nateva LLC. as a foot in the door to get what they really want, which is the concert venue. OR BOTH. As I said I smell at least one rat here, and more than likely many. You make the call. I guess I'm just not understanding the problem... but I thought it seemed like a majority of the local people to this festival were happy about it coming because they're tired of traveling long distances just to see shows. So, I would think that they'd be welcoming of a new venue nearby. Soooo... my thought process would then make me think that IF it took one to get the other (Live Nation's new venue = Nateva, or vice versa), that's still a positive... even if so many people have a problem with Live Nation itself. I'm not really following the concerns with space either... its not like all of these plans aren't going to be approved for safety purposes, size limitations, expansion, etc./whatever. I can't imagine something detrimental to the area being built. Just doesn't make sense. |
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Post by crixtala on Apr 20, 2010 8:53:30 GMT -5
Sorry monkeys... didn't mean to fan a new fire with my response. ;D
I guess I just don't get the fuss about the whole thing...
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Post by itrainmonkeys on Apr 20, 2010 9:02:49 GMT -5
Sorry monkeys... didn't mean to fan a new fire with my response. ;D I guess I just don't get the fuss about the whole thing... No problem. Just didn't want new/uninformed members to begin worrying/asking questions about stuff that has already been answered. This thread has tons of info/debate already so why not keep it all together. ;D |
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Post by vincheese on Apr 20, 2010 15:21:13 GMT -5
Obviously Livenation merging with Ticketmaster is not a good thing. I dont necessarily like Livenation and their very high fees, but I do like how Frank was upfront and honest about the whole thing. I also enjoy the fact that all I know about the head of Nateva is that his name is "Frank." Livenation does have a stranglehold on the ticketing/venues in the Northeast, but for something of such a large size to come together in its first year such as Nateva, sometimes you have to play the game. That being said, me and all my friends are looking forward to this July 4th weekend ALOT, and hopefully everyone here can focus their energy on how much fun it will be. Can't wait.
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Post by mattinthehat on Apr 20, 2010 20:31:54 GMT -5
You guys are missing my point completely. As I clearly said in my post, I do not care about Live Nation and their monopoly. That issue is for Congress, the courts, and the bureaucrats to decide. I started a new thread for a reason, which should have been obvious if you gave my post a little thought.
My point was that you cannot have a 20,000 seat amphitheater, and all of it's associated space requirements, IN THE SAME SPACE as a 15,000 person festival, with camping, rv's, stage, vendor areas etc. It can't happen, unless Nateva, going forward, has the Festival on the grounds, and IN the amphitheater. That means camping in the parking areas, and the music being held IN the amphitheater. The Festival cannot continue in it's current form on those fairgrounds after the Live Nation venue is built. There is not enough room. So, to reiterate what I said in the thread that was hijacked and lumped into this probably dead thread is: either Live Nation is going to ultimately move Nateva out, or... Frank is working with Live Nation and Nateva is a 2 year deal, or Nateva will be held at the amphitheater in the future. If the latter takes place, then the open-air nature oriented Festival will essentially be held on asphalt and concrete.
I would like to ask the Moderator to please reactivate my original thread, and move this post to it. I started that thread for a reason, and it was not to join a chorus of whiners who can't accept the concept of Capitalism.
Thank you.
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Post by wvmountainweir on Apr 20, 2010 21:12:25 GMT -5
Mattinthehat, I see what you are saying here about the future of Nateva. And also agree that the old thread shouldnt have been locked.
But what happens in the future is just that; the future. This is Nateva's first year, so who knows how things will pan out 4th of July weekend, let alone a few years down the road. Personally I am not too worried because of that fact. I will enjoy this festival in its first year, and take in-stride whatever happens in the future. I understand your concern and questioning, but I dont think there is really much that can be done at this point. Though having the festival inside an ampitheatre would be lame as hell....
"May be goin' to hell in a bucket, but at least I am enjoying the ride" ;D
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Post by mattinthehat on Apr 20, 2010 22:19:38 GMT -5
wvmountainweir, thanks for recognizing what I was trying to get across. You are, so far, in a club of one.
I agree with virtually everything that you said, and like you, I will be there to support this festival. One thing that you, and most of the other members here, probably don't understand is the frustration that we Mainers feel when it comes to concerts, and especially festivals here. When UPNORTH was announced, that was the first real multi-act major headliners festival that we had here in many years. The last big one that I can remember here was the Evergreen Valley festival in the 70's. So UPNORTH happens, I go, have a great time (I didn't camp, so I did not see the sketch factor). and plan to spend all weekend last year. So when I found out that there would be no year 2 of UPNORTH, I was totally bummed. Now Nateva comes along, with more bands, far superior organization, responsiveness (other than the mandatory 2 person min. on RVs-I'm an semi-old fart with health issues and most people my age gave up festivals long ago), and generally great ideas on how to do this festival. So once again, I am fired up, until I read the details of what Live Nation is planning in Oxford. You read my post, and you obviously understood it, so you have to realize my letdown here. Yes, it will be great for 1 or 2 years, and I am certainly grateful for Frank and his friend's efforts. But the bottom line is the bottom line, and we all get there sooner or later.
No matter which way this goes, the music fans here get a better deal than we have had (unless they both tank.) I guess I think this festival has a better chance of long term survival here than a Great Woods clone. When you get here, you'll realize why I say that. Oxford IS in the middle of nowhere. As you said, all we can do is take it one year at a time, and hope for the best.
On a side note, do they still do the Mountain Stage shows down there? I have a musician friend from way back, who moved to Princeton quite a few years ago. Princeton used to be like a mini Austin, or Athens. Is it still a music hot spot?
Take care,
Matt
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Post by wvmountainweir on Apr 20, 2010 22:52:48 GMT -5
I hear ya. This festival seems heaven-sent so far and it would really be a bummer for it to take that path w/ livenation and and ampitheatre. And ampitheatres are so generic these days, they can (almost) suck the soul right out of a show...
...And I am not so sure about Princeton, I havnt heard of anything happening down there in quite a while, though I must admit I have never been there. They do, however host Mountain Stage events at WVU in Morgantown as well as Charleston I believe. Just a few weeks ago there was one with a few acts including Jakob Dylan and his new band (who are rumored to be at Nateva this year by the way). But it seems the WV music scene is dying, at least in the Northern part of the state. sad actually...
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Dexxy
Bull Rider
Rawk
Posts: 408
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Post by Dexxy on Apr 20, 2010 23:59:27 GMT -5
Matt, IF the amphitheater were to be built, it would be an expansion off of the current fairgrounds. It wouldnt be something that would entail tearing the fairgrounds down and replacing it with another venue. So dont worry about them trying to fit both into the same area, that is not the goal. As far as I have heard there isnt a whole lot of momentum behind getting it built anyways. Hopefully, if the festival is successful, Oxford locals will push to keep the venue as is for the festival and not let Live Nation get a hand in anything. I think that really would be the biggest factor, locals and getting them to support all things Nateva. I believe the locals will understand that a venue hosting multiple concerts a year in that location would quickly lose customers that were willing to travel to get there. A major festival once a year would be a much better investment for the town IMO.
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Post by crixtala on Apr 21, 2010 8:18:17 GMT -5
Bleh... wanted this post in the other thread.  |
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First of all, I would like to thank Frank for his, well...frankness with regard to his association with Live Nation. That being said, I believe we have a potentially serious problem with this "partnership".
I guess I'm just not understanding the problem... but I thought it seemed like a majority of the local people to this festival were happy about it coming because they're tired of traveling long distances just to see shows. So, I would think that they'd be welcoming of a new venue nearby.
